EVE Mouse Ideas

[Bexin]

Hi,
I would like to see eve mouse, so I created this topic for people who have ideas about mouse. Down I also written most of my ideas based on what customers wanted from mouses before.
I would also need help from you, if you have Logitech powerplay pad, than please take , from bottom from your mouse and measure voltages so we now which side is + and which -.
Short list of what do I think community would want, if you have more ideas write to this topic. My ideas:
(Bigger letters are meaning more important and normal ideas. It would be best if all of them are included:

Graphene batteries - Probably not Lighter, bigger capacity, faster charging but higher price
USB C
4 directional wheel
Fingerprint sensor under side buttons or on analog stick
Price under 100 bucks
Lightweight
Two buttons on upside, one smaller, second bigger, both programmable. smaller mainly for DPI
At least 24 hours of battery life with RGB on
Optical switches
Onboard memory
Wireless programable - programmable without wired connection to PC
Wireless 1 ms USB connection
Bluetooth 5
Ergonomic design
Software support for Windows, Apple and Linux
Smaller-mid size
At least 16000 DPI high-end sensor

Than some nice posibilities with explanation:

Wireless charging - I would really like to see wireless charging. It would be best if it will be like pluggable part. There could be coin shape and size QI charging module, but that hole in Mose for that coin can ‘‘occasionally’’ have same size as Logitech power play coin, so if you buy Logitech power play pad, you can put their charging in that place and you will have unlimited play while being on mousepad
.
.
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Changable parts - there can be many different options of mouse, but that will be hard to manufacture, so mouse can have 3 parts (4 with that wireless module):

Body - 2 versions, Normal with RGB and version with holes for lightweight

Right side - 4 base versions, easy addable news. 3 versions:
Version with 9/12 numbers and RGB
Version with two buttons and RGB
Version with two buttons and analog stick below them and RGB
Version with 7/8 buttons in circle and Analog stick in mid, also RGB

Left side - 3 base versions:
Version with 2 buttons and RGB
Version with no buttons and normal side
Version with no buttons and holes in side

…Right and left side would be hot-swappable

So now it comes to software:

• All platforms (Windows, Mac, Linus)
• Wirelessly programmable (when connected with wireless usb) for all platforms
• Addable Dpi profiles, 1-8, switchable via button
• Possibility of programing different profiles for different programs
• Analog stick - option of for directions (and sometimes 2 active at time) or Analog output, like controller stick.
• Swapping between monitors by button
• Remapable buttons, different key shortages, different function, also fn function for Mac
• 1 ms

And Hardware:

Mouse base:
Hot swappable Battery, from side
Bluetooth module
Wireless 2.4/5 Ghz module for usb with 1 ms
Slot for USB wireless adapter
Two optical switches
Low power mcu, my idea is ATSAML21
4 directional and pressable wheel, lighter press weight
Two upper buttons
If not lightweight - than RGB
Board for charging battery, regulating power
Two switches on bottom, one between Bluetooth/Wireless usb and one ON/OFF
Magnets to connect sides, power and comunication connectors for sides
Bottom slot for Qi module or Logitech Power Play, with 3 connections, one for + of QI, one for -and one for + of Logitech
6/4 light bottom mounting screws

Sides
Buttons
RGB
Magnets to connect
Connectors for power and control
NO screws

Module
Qi receiver
Voltage regulator to 5v
Connection

Outside
USB C to USB C
USB C to USB A
Wireless USB connection

First plan for look:


Image not finished, in cause I do not now which is + and - yet. Blue parts would be RGB
QI reciever, swappable with Logitech:

Logitech reciever:

What do you think about that idea, if you have got more ideas, write in comments and it can be added here, will be updating this topic. Also you can write some ideas for name of the mouse.

• It has everything I want
• I will add something
• I will remove / change some feature

There will be also slot to put usb, and changeable battery (if battery is not working, if there is some tech improvement, like double capacity same weight, you can replace battery:

Currently working on blender model

Worked more than 6 hours on it, still having some problems with blender

Update:

Update, bottom finished:

Working on top:

This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License.

[TristanSchaaf]

Awesome topic

Mouses are a real pet peeve of mine so I would love an Eve mouse. I got the Logitech G502 lightspeed and the MX Master 3 this week, so I’m kinda good for now, but more competition is better!

Some things:

• Graphene batteries aren’t production ready iirc… so that’s a no-go.
• USB-C yes
• I prefer the the side scrolling of the MX master series, but we might be able to implement both?
• Price isn’t something to take into account at this stage, as prices will be way different as what you, me or anyone else thinks it’ll be.
• Lightweight: Not entirely sure I want light-light, I like the heft of the Master series for office work.
• Two buttons; I really like how the G502 does it.
• Battery life: Nice strive, it’s a given that maximum battery life should be targetted.
• Optical switches… No so sure about this one. I don’t like them that much
• Onboard memory, I think for profile memory over different devices? I would say we’d want that.
• Wireless programmable, I don’t think that it’s that different from wired tbh.
• Wireless fast - Would be nice, but I’d guess we need to see what tech we can license. Either that from logitech or razer would be good I think?
• BT5: Not entirely sure a mouse needs BT5, but feel free to change my mind.
• Ergonomic design: Well that’s a given.
• Software support: Hard to do for Eve, but nothing is impossible
• Smaller-mid size… Oh boi I have some ideas about that
• At least 16000 DPI sensor: That’s probably expensive, but if possible, hell yeah!

Wireless charging: Eve would probably just use the open Qi standard for that. But personally I don’t feel it’s needed for multiple week battery. I’ve had every MX mouse from logitech (Revolution, Performance, Master 1, 2(s) and now the 3, charging them for 1 hour once a month didn’t feel like a bother. Plus I didn’t need a special mousepad and could still use it while it’s charging. So I would skip that.

Changable parts: I would love this, that way you could make the mouse as well left as right handed in the same SKU. And make it smaller/bigger depending on your hands, tastes,etc. Left and right should be mirrored to each other to accommodate both people. Extra buttons are nice to have, but don’t need that much.

I love if we could license the scrollwheel of the MX Master 3, man I’m in love with that thing.

Also, RGB would be a no for me. I would like an office mouse which can game as well. Kinda like Spectrum does with gaming screens but also office

[Bexin]

TristanSchaaf
Graphene batteries aren’t production ready iirc… so that’s a no-go.

This is why I did not included them in strong text but I have recently seen them in some products, also Samsung is using them

I prefer the the side scrolling of the MX master series, but we might be able to implement both?

I think it is possible, by 4 directional I mean you can slightly move it to side like on razor mouses, you see < and > there:

Lightweight: Not entirely sure I want light-light, I like the heft of the Master series for office work.

I think that more people want lightweight now, but it will be possible to place weight on place of wireless receiver which would not give you chance to charge wirelessly but can add weight

Battery life: Nice strive, it’s a given that maximum battery life should be targetted.

That is true, but I wrote what should be minimal number for that maximum life

Optical switches… No so sure about this one. I don’t like them that much

There is no big difference, only improved response time, you feel same click

Wireless programmable, I don’t think that it’s that different from wired tbh.

Some people want to use Wireless and when they can charge wirelessly and use it everywhere wirelessly than I think that wireless programming would be nice feature

Wireless fast - Would be nice, but I’d guess we need to see what tech we can license. Either that from logitech or razer would be good I think?

Yes, something like that, and if you would contact Logitech, than you can also ask about powerplay certification so you can tell more people that it Is possible

BT5: Not entirely sure a mouse needs BT5, but feel free to change my mind.

I have recently seen high-end mouse which has Bluetooth, Wireless usb is only for small range, and if someone uses mouse and keyboard in bigger distance with laptop it can be nice. also 5 should be Faster, using 4.2 or another is also option.

Software support: Hard to do for Eve, but nothing is impossible

I have some Macs in home so it would be very nice.

At least 16000 DPI sensor: That’s probably expensive, but if possible, hell yeah!

16000 is normal for High-end mouses

Wireless charging: Eve would probably just use the open Qi standard for that. But personally I don’t feel it’s needed for multiple week battery. I’ve had every MX mouse from logitech (Revolution, Performance, Master 1, 2(s) and now the 3, charging them for 1 hour once a month didn’t feel like a bother. Plus I didn’t need a special mousepad and could still use it while it’s charging. So I would skip that.

Some people want it, also I am going to build in Qi charger into my case. Logitech powerplay can be just compatible, that you can put that in, it is outputting 5v so no problem, just similar placed connectors for option. Also extra weight can be added in place for Qi/logitech

Changable parts: I would love this, that way you could make the mouse as well left as right handed in the same SKU. And make it smaller/bigger depending on your hands, tastes,etc. Left and right should be mirrored to each other to accommodate both people. Extra buttons are nice to have, but don’t need that much.

These extra button types are for different types of games, I would pick 2 buttons with analog, Left and Right side compatibility can be problem because ergonomic mouses have different sides so 2 products needed

Also, RGB would be a no for me. I would like an office mouse which can game as well. Kinda like Spectrum does with gaming screens but also office

You can turn RGB off of course, it will only longer your battery life.

Also Logitechs system looks like this:

In hand he is holding wireless reciever and there is extra weight in table. Than there are places in mouse for that module. If we would add one pin and use same dimensions you can have QI/Logitech powerplay/ Extra weight, whatever you want. Logitech powerplay module comes packed with powerplay mousepad

[TristanSchaaf]

I’m very familiar with the Logitech mouse eco system. Both the professional and the gaming part. As I said I just got the mx master 3 and g502 this week, loving them so far. But both mice have their own place.

Adding options into the mice will inevitably increase costs so, for example RGB, will increase costs (and the software to maintain it) while it doesn’t really add to the feature part. In some sense my view on powerplay/Qi charging is the same. It’s a gimmick that won’t return for new products as you cant use the mouse everywhere if you use razer it’s approach which makes the mouse ultra light due to no battery. You can’t use the mouse if you want to charge it that way, and charging takes longer.
I much prefer a month or 2 battery life with charging within 30 minutes or so with a cable.

But this is my personal view and if the community back you up on either or both of the features then apparently I’m the minority and need to accept RGB on the mouse

As for bt5 and graphene batteries : just because there is a new tech doesn’t mean it’s better to use it. I don’t know anything about graphene. And the extra bandwidth of bt5 doesn’t allow faster connections. The increased range is a nice thing but I won’t use my mouse if I can’t see my screen. Bt4 already supports my entire appartement. Albeit with increases latency. But the lower energy consumption might make it better.

It’s kinda like the port discussion on spectrum. People wanted the latest HDMI and DP ports on the base model while the current accepted versions were far greater supported and can already drive the screen at max settings.

[Bexin]

As I said, BT4 or other is also option, RGB is on many mouses for 13 bucks, so I think it is just feature. QI would add cost so this is why you could by it separately, it won’t come with mouse. also Logitech wireless would increase price only for people buying it. Logitech wireless needs to just be bought from Logitech site and it outputs regulated. voltage - no increased cost, RGB is cheap and some people may want it. Qi charging is also optional.

[Teabix]

I would suggest “being easy to clean” a requirement for the housing design. To demonstrate the problem here’s the “CS-Storm Inferno”, a great gaming mouse but unfortunatelly also the perfect example for this issue:

The problem areas are:

1. RED: Seams. There are no screws separating those seams, it’s glued together. The most obvious dirt collects there and is nearly impossible to remove. Even needles and razors merely scratch the surface of the housing near the seam and don’t really remove the dirt anyway. Instead of glueing the two parts together, simple screws would have significantly improved product usage with negligible cost in production.
2. PURPLE: Grip trenches on both sides of the mouse. The idea is nice, make the mouse easier to grip, but the material of the side-panel is a soft rubbery plastic which is destroyed by utensils sharp enough to get into the trench. The trenches are simply too deep, so any dirt passing by prefers to stay in there. Simple solution is to not put any grip trenches, or at least make them less “trenchy”.
   
3. ORANGE: Button crevaces. Screwing the mouse apart does not give you the ability to detach the buttons from the housing. They’re plastic-welded together. The only way to get them apart is to break them apart. This also makes it impossible to clean after spilling coke all over your desktop. Simple screws would have solved the problem with negligible cost in production.

Unscrewing the mouse removes warranty, and that’s totally fine. By the time the mouse needs this kind of cleaning, the warranty period is over anyway. It’s more about the principle of creating a nice product that lasts. So the problem is mostly the lack of screws.

And you should probably wash your hands before using your PC anyway but that solution only works in the short term, and for people who don’t drink coke

Some mice have a feature that coincidentally also solves the cleaning problem, at least partially. For example:

I’m still sceptical about the buttons though, looks like they might be welded into the housing as well, but this picture is just for inspiration purposes.

[Bexin]

yes, I have seen this mouse and this was main inspiration for side panels for me. I want to do just magnet connection with one holding which can be released as I shown before, and bottom would be screwed to top in my plan.

[Konstantinos]

Awesome topic! Would Eve keyboard make sense as well if we start working on the mouse. @TristanSchaaf is right about graphene this technology is not in mass production yet but other specs seem feasible!

We just need to check out who are the best mouse manufacturers out there !

By the way I noticed there is a lot of mentions of Logitech products. How do you feel about Razer as mice brand? I am just curious.

And last question, if you could choose only one, what would be 1 unique thing about Eve mouse ?

[Bexin]

Would Eve keyboard make sense as well if we start working on the mouse.

Yes, but if it is going to be high-end then there is very good Switch option that only one keyboard has. Try to contact wooting for their lekker switches. They are fast, hot-swappable and the Ultimate about them is full Range analog input. 0.1-4mm. Also they software is opensource. You can do 3 things that they do not have- waterproofness wireless and better look

[Bexin]

Konstantinos
By the way I noticed there is a lot of mentions of Logitech products. How do you feel about Razer as mice brand? I am just curious.

I think that razor is good and have best optical sensors and also optical switches. But we were mostly talking about wireless technology. Qi standard and Logitech, but there is no problem about Logitech compatibility because everything comes with powerplay pad. So mouse just need to have Place to put power coin

And last question, if you could choose only one, what would be 1 unique thing about Eve mouse ?

I am not entirely sure, but I think this wireless. combination of wireless charging connection and software updating without physical connection, also got idea for name - Eve lightning

@TristanSchaaf is right about graphene this technology is not in mass production yet but other specs seem feasible!

That graphene batteries aren’t necessary. It would be great if mouse will come with all other written features

Also check my new pictures from blender about how mouse can look, still working on it you would find it and updates in main topic.
Also ability to see procenatge of battery is important and when there will be that changeable battery, there could be shown how many percents of new battery does it have (batteries damages and lost capacity over time) so people would now when to replace their batteries

Also name for your wireless system can be Eve Lightning

[TristanSchaaf]

Personally I don’t like the feel of the Razer buttons, to mushy. But that’s opinion based.

I’m also in love with the MX master 3 scroll wheel, the way they made it feels just amazing. It doesn’t convey right on text you should really use it on your desk. It’s so smooth and the magnetic clicks are amazing.

Razer does make really good mice, their wireless tech is great. The mamba + firefly idea was also very neat. But i prefer the clickyness of logitech gaming mouse when it comes to gaming.

[Bexin]

Yes but that optical switches are new type with other feel so that won’t be problem. Or contact Logitech if they have optical switches

[seppe]

Hey @Bexin I like your idea of using the Logitech power play puck, though I don’t think Logitech would appreciate it unless some sort of licensing agreement is set up. This would add to the cost of the mouse.

You seem to want to tick a lot of boxes for a very low price point. I don’t think this would ever be feasible. E.g having this amount of modules sounds good on paper, but you have to keep in mind that price is largely defined by demand. Having one mouse everyone buys will make it’s price lower. Eve products are already more niche than the conventional brands. On top of this some of the modules could have very little demand, impacting their price point dramatically. Same goes for 1ms latency tech. This is not something off-the-shelf BLE / radio can do. It requires a lot of R&D and custom hardware, making it more expensive. This is why vendors market it so much: they spent a lot of money on it, so now it’s up to the marketing department to get a good return on that investment. Thinking this technology now just “exists” and can be readily put in any mouse is a bit naive.

I do like the idea of an EVE mouse though, but mainly because it could offer some design continuity between products. The base could e.g be made from the same dark gray aluminum as the spectrum monitor and EVE V. Some features I would be interested in:

• Design continuity with other EVE products. I think EVE could distinguish itself as a company making products suitable for gaming, without the overly “gamery” look. This seems what most websites talk about when talking about the Spectrum monitor already.
• High quality, easy to clean materials and design. A lot of mice suffer from getting nasty like @Teabix mentioned. Rubber coatings tend to wear off and become “shiny”. If you used the Logitech MX Master for a while you should now what I mean. I think some high quality (PBT?) plastic or aluminium could improve this. A removable mouse wheel would also be interesting, those things get nasty.
• As @TristanSchaaf mentioned, the scroll wheel of the Logitech MX Master and Revolution is awesome. If this and/or the power play technology could be licensed I would be super interested. I don’t think it would happen though.
  A thumb rest and maybe pinky rest (though pinky rests make the mouse look awkward IMO)

Some more “out of the box” ideas:

• Finger print scanner for Windows Hello login (and other platforms, though I don’t now if MacOS has an API for this), maybe + secure element for 2FA.
• Touch pad for gestures, like Apple’s magic mouse. If it wasn’t so ridiculously uncomfortable and slippery I would have considered using it. This could also solve the nasty scroll wheel problem, though I don’t think I could give up my scroll wheel TBH.

[Bexin]

seppe
Hey @Bexin I like your idea of using the Logitech power play puck, though I don’t think Logitech would appreciate it unless some sort of licensing agreement is set up. This would add to the cost of the mouse.

This is the reason why the compatibility won’t be official, it will only fit. using 5v is normal. if you will look at my render, I added third pin so no one can tell that it is same layout. So no law problems and compatibility.

You seem to want to tick a lot of boxes for a very low price point. I don’t think this would ever be feasible. E.g having this amount of modules sounds good on paper, but you have to keep in mind that price is largely defined by demand.

100 bucks is not low price, also I meaned that parts to be bought separately. Everyone will choose option when buying, and also option of bought new sides separately.

Having one mouse everyone buys will make it’s price lower.

This is reason why I want this mouse to have everything gamer could want

Finger print scanner for Windows Hello login (and other platforms, though I don’t now if MacOS has an API for this), maybe + secure element for 2FA.

This would be nice, to have option for that on left side under buttons/on analog stick, added it as important

[seppe]

@Bexin

This is the reason why the compatibility won’t be official, it will only fit. using 5v is normal. if you will look at my render, I added third pin so no one can tell that it is same layout. So no law problems and compatibility.

Look at this from Logitech’s perspective. They spent years and a lot of money on developing the power play system. If you make a mouse “fit” the power play puck you make it compatible. You could opt not to mention power play anywhere (though then people wouldn’t know about the feature) but it is still a thin line to walk. Working together with Logitech would insure proper mechanical and electrical compatibility as well as avoid any IP issues. IMO it’s also just the proper thing to do. Eve shouldn’t act like a cheap Chinese copy cat, there’s already plenty of those.

[Bexin]

Look, powerplay module can be used for every mouse, if you make hole there. But yes it will be best to have cooperation with Logitech - their Powerplay certification, hero sensor and their light speed wireless technology.

[TristanSchaaf]

Ok, apparently I’m out of the loop. Here is my current knowledge about the wireless charging for mice:
Logitech markets it the most aggressively with PowerPlay. Most other brands have a similar idea.

Most wireless charging mice (I assume the one being discussed here) have one feature: If you place the mouse on a Qi charging module, the mouse will charge itself.
Now here is the thing with that idea: By default, Qi charging doesn’t allow for movement. This means you actually have to let the mouse sit there to charge. Even with a 24h battery you need to remember to put the mouse on the charging spot every other night. Besides that, Qi is slower then a wired connection.

There are exceptions to the above. Razer Mamba for example doesn’t have a bulky heavy battery in the mouse. With their firefly mousepad you can use it while keeping it lightweight. BUT you need to use that mousepad and can’t use the mouse on the go.

And if we do go for an multi-coiled mousepad, so that there won’t be a single zone but more an area or the entire mousepad, that will get expensive. Besides all of that, the users would even have to replace their mousepads to use the function at all, which personally I’m not willing to do.

I’m not saying Eve shouldn’t do it. I’m just trying to understand the usecase for it. For me I see a lot of downsides, and not really an upside. Feel free to try to change my mind though.

[Bexin]

The thing is that if mouse will use layout where powerplay will fit. Users can choose. That can pay 100$ for Powerplay mousepad or 5$ for Qi reciever. Thing is that with qi charging you can go with mouse anywhere without cables. I am doing mod to the pc case so I will have 5 coil dual Qi charger on it and also I have seen powerbank with Wi charging. I really don’t like hyper flux idea. When you are traveling you must carry your mousepad everywhere, even if you are moving to another place in house for minute. I have 16$ aorus M2 which has good sensor, is not wireless but can be used on every surface. And back to the Qi, before I found eve I was thinking about ordering Logitech g703 and about moding it. I even ordered 3$ Receiver coil with regulation to 5v that can fit. Also most vote says it has everything I want, no vote says that someone wants to remove something

[BlasterJoni]

I was seeing the conversation about the battery and charging and whatnot and had to signup just to answer.
Even tho the wireless charging when using the mouse would be nice, it requires a special mousepad, thus making people buy more hardware and change more of their setup, something most people wont be willing to, also it would take away the hability to use the mouse without the mousepad (well after it looses all charge if there is no other way to charge it).

I think the way to go is to take a page from the book of old cellphones like steelseries did with their arctis pro wireless headset and have removable batteries, like the logitech ones you were sugesting, and having some kind of dock where you could charge a second battery so when the battery ran out and you needed to keep using the mouse you could just switch the battery. The dock would also be used to dock the mouse when not in use to charge the battery currently inside.

The steelseries headset I was talking about, and the removable batteries

My idea for a dock would be something like the old steelseries sensei mouse dock, where in the middle you would have a hole for the other battery to charge so that you could charge both at the same time overnigth, so the extra battery would be sitting in its hole in the dock and the mouse would be put on top of it to charge the battery thats currently inside.

I’ve been hoping logitech would do this dock extra battery thing for a while now, and the fact that they haven’t has been the only thing keeping me from changing my g502 to the new wireless version. Would be cool if the eve mouse did it.

[Bexin]

Wireless charging is more useful I think